Discussion of good and evil and Batman the Animated Series

"CalzoneGolem" (calzonegolem) 12/13/2013 at 10:28 • Filed to: None

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We borrowed a season of BTAS from a friend for our son. Our daughter has become infatuated with Harley, Catwoman and Poison Ivy.

While we were waiting for the bus we were talking about these characters and whether they were "good guys" or "bad guys."

Any Batman fan can tell you that these characters all occasion work with Bats and/or Bruce. She came to the conclusion that the boys have to be either good or bad but the girls can be both/either. Some heavy stuff for 6:40 am

For Sweden > CalzoneGolem 12/13/2013 at 10:33

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A woman can't be a love interest if she's just an antagonist.

CalzoneGolem > For Sweden 12/13/2013 at 10:34

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Of the three mentioned, whom would you pursue?

For Sweden > CalzoneGolem 12/13/2013 at 10:37

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Don't know enough about Batman to answer that.

Tom McParland > CalzoneGolem 12/13/2013 at 10:37

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And that is one of the many reasons BMATS was an excellent show.

Arch Duke Maxyenko, Shit Talk Extraordinaire > CalzoneGolem 12/13/2013 at 10:37

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Batman works with his entire rouges gallery, at various times. Of course they will try to betray him, but he is always prepared. Also, Harley, Catwoman, and Ivy are all bi-sexual.

Arch Duke Maxyenko, Shit Talk Extraordinaire > CalzoneGolem 12/13/2013 at 10:43

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Catwoman, hands down.

Harley is fucking crazy, and who knows what she got from the Joker

Poison Ivy will try to make you here slave.

CalzoneGolem > Arch Duke Maxyenko, Shit Talk Extraordinaire 12/13/2013 at 10:54

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I'd say that is part of Harley's charm.

Arch Duke Maxyenko, Shit Talk Extraordinaire > CalzoneGolem 12/13/2013 at 10:54

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Syphilis?

CalzoneGolem > Arch Duke Maxyenko, Shit Talk Extraordinaire 12/13/2013 at 10:54

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Yes.

Walfisch > Arch Duke Maxyenko, Shit Talk Extraordinaire 12/13/2013 at 10:57

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Yep. That's one of the things that I like about Batman - he doesn't mind getting his hands dirty in order to pursue a greater good, at the same time, he prepares for every possible contingency. Although I'm not sure if "working" with the bad guys is the right term - it's more like he's "utilizing" them, I think.

Also, I have no idea that Harley, Catwoman, and Ivy are by.

Arch Duke Maxyenko, Shit Talk Extraordinaire > Walfisch 12/13/2013 at 11:00

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When ever Joker beats Harley a little too hard, she shacks up with Ivy. Ivy is mostly a lesbian, with the hots for the Bats. Catwoman is down for whatever.

Destructive Tester > CalzoneGolem 12/13/2013 at 11:02

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FYI, Amazon Prime has BMTAS available for free streaming.
As far as the rogues gallery occasionally assisting Batman, the best "bad guys" are the ones who are misguided in the means by which they pursue an otherwise good goal. This could be a good opportunity to teach your daughter that the means used to reach an end matter and the world isn't always black and white.

Walfisch > Arch Duke Maxyenko, Shit Talk Extraordinaire 12/13/2013 at 11:09

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Thanks for the info. I really want to get into Batman for some time now but I'm a little intimidated as to where to jump in. I'm thinking to just collect the graphic novels, but I'm sure that's not enough, so every time I encounter tidbits like these, I get all giddy.

And those three getting together, nice. Here's a photo for your troubles!

CalzoneGolem > Destructive Tester 12/13/2013 at 11:10

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No doubt but 6:40am on a Friday is not daddy's best thinking time.

Destructive Tester > CalzoneGolem 12/13/2013 at 11:18

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I can definitely understand that... Unfortunately by 6:40 I've been at work the better part of an hour.
It is encouraging to see the classics still appeal to the next generation.

CalzoneGolem > Destructive Tester 12/13/2013 at 11:19

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We also watch Darkwing Duck and a few other shows from that era.

Arch Duke Maxyenko, Shit Talk Extraordinaire > Walfisch 12/13/2013 at 11:21

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Defiantly watch TAS. To start reading in order:

Year One

Long Halloween

Dark Victory

The Killing Joke

The Knight Fall series (If you have the time)

Arkham Asylum: A Serious House on Serious Earth

Then watch Batman Beyond and the Movie after the series

Destructive Tester > CalzoneGolem 12/13/2013 at 11:25

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Well that's just "parenting done right" right there...

Walfisch > Arch Duke Maxyenko, Shit Talk Extraordinaire 12/13/2013 at 11:31

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Yeah, the watching part I already got that down, TAS is free for Amazon Prime members (I saw the initial run back then, but I missed a few episodes), and I already completed my Batman Beyond marathon a few months ago. Almost all of the DCUA Batman stuff I already saw as well. So right now, I'm all about the comic book jump.

Arch Duke Maxyenko, Shit Talk Extraordinaire > Walfisch 12/13/2013 at 11:34

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After you finish all of those I mentioned above, read The Dark Knight Returns . Does Amazon have Under The Red Hood ? Watch that if they do.

Walfisch > Arch Duke Maxyenko, Shit Talk Extraordinaire 12/13/2013 at 11:39

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Under The Red Hood, hands down, is my favorite Batman movie (beating the Nolan trilogy even). I don't think it's free yet in Prime, but again, already saw that one. I was a little apprehensive about that one, because Kevin Conroy is not the VA for Batman, but Bruce Greenwood did so well in that movie. He was also the reason why I initially watched Young Justice... but I stayed because it was a great show by itself.

Axial > CalzoneGolem 12/13/2013 at 17:40

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Interesting conclusion to arrive at, considering Harvey Dent is bi-modal and that Rupert Thorne's competitor worked with Batman. What makes B:TAS so great is that it works well within the grey zone such that the only trulyevil characters are Thorne, The Joker, and The Penguin. Everybody else? They have reasons and circumstances. The episodes with Mr. Freeze offered some rather chilling dialogue, and Clayface's transformation into a criminal was believable and easy to sympathetize with.

Axial > Arch Duke Maxyenko, Shit Talk Extraordinaire 12/13/2013 at 17:41

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In addition to what others mentioned, don't forget to watch Sub Zero , either. Mr. Freeze is always great to see on-screen in the DCAU.

*Edit* Whoops, meant for Walfisch.

Destructive Tester > Axial 12/13/2013 at 23:07

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Excellent pull on the Heart of Ice episode!
I agree on the observation about the moral grey-area of so many villains; the best ones are always the ones who are fighting for a cause that isn't necessarily evil, it just runs counter to everyone else's.
Since I'm more knowledgable on Marvel, I'll use the Civil War arc as an example. Here was a story with no real "villains" just factions of heroes with opposing views; one let by Tony Stark, the other led by Captain America. I think the lack of any true villain was what made the story so interesting.